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Trebor999
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mad.gif posted on 14-1-2008 at 01:38
My first song/ vst voice harmonizer


Hi everyone, I'm faily new to this forum and was hoping to meet some new friends. I just finished my first recording with KAE. This program is awesome. Here is a url to my recording if anyone wants to listen. (Again this Time ).

http://www.robertleehall.com/music.html

While reading thru the forum, I saw a few peeps looking for a free VST vocal harmonizer. After much seaching I found this one called Choralozoide. I used it in my first song call "Again this time".

http://pagesperso-orange.fr/numerikart/products.htm
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[*] posted on 14-1-2008 at 04:24


Great work, Trebor! Again This Time is really well mixed and aurally, pretty well perfect, at least to my ears. I have to check out this Choralozoide. I also thought Waitin By The Window was really good. Hauntingly Lennon like. What you're doing is good, keep it up.

J
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[*] posted on 14-1-2008 at 04:31


Oh, and I meant to ask. What are you using for drums? Is that Leafdrums?

J
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[*] posted on 14-1-2008 at 05:24


And also, what were your general settings on Choralozoide for Again This Time? I've played around a little, but can't seem to get "that" sound. And I like it.

J
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[*] posted on 14-1-2008 at 08:13


Hi Trebor999

Thanks for giving us the chance to have a listen to your music. Generally pretty darn good. You have quite an interesting voice to listen to.

I am not a real critic but i have to say ....... Oh noooooo:)................I would prefer to have some of the guitar parts panned slightly left or right. I was hearing most all the instruments dead centre ( i though I had my headphone switch to mono but it wasn't).
In saying that, when there were acoustic solo parts that should stand out, to my "old" ears it got a bit muddy/confused and it was quite hard to separate the sounds.

A couple of questions:
Do you record the acoustic by mike or direct in?
Are you setting tracks/wavers to record in stereo or just mono?
Do you apply different vst's to the different guitar tracks or are you using the same across the board?

Sometimes it can be beneficial to use a different reverb setting on a solo than the one used on rhythm for example, just to give them a bit of separation.

Apart from all that:) I personally quite like your songs. I also like the Waiting By The Window tune. You have just started using KAE to record and so far you have done a pretty good job.




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[*] posted on 17-1-2008 at 07:44


Hey Trebor, come on back! We'd really like your input on the work you've put up here. I think it's really good (and so do others) so it would be cool to know what you employed to get your sound. And hopefully there'll be more sounds forthcoming from you!

J
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[*] posted on 24-1-2008 at 07:40


I guess Trebor ain't coming back. that's too bad, cause I really liked his work, and would have liked to learn the specifics. Well, if you're reading, Trebor, post again. Your muse is good!
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[*] posted on 4-2-2008 at 07:15


Hi All, Sorry. I forgot about this post. I'll try to answer all those questions.
1) Drums? well I was using my keyboard drums for "again this time", found a few drum loops on the net and tried to splice, but now im using Battery 3, Was very expensive!
2) Choralozoide Vocal Harmonizer? This rascal was hard to figure out and I still dont got it down yet. (jm2552, if you sent me a email I will email u back with some instructions)
3) Stereo? Hey Dino, It was recorded in mono. I have since learned to record in stereo. You can chk out this new tune
http://robertleehall.home.insightbb.com/music/YouSayYouLoveM...
4) I was using a bad mic at first but, now im going direct in to tascam mixer via accoustic guitar pickup.
5) VST'S? I'm just now learning to use limiters, compression and stereo expander vst's and a few others.
I was so bombarded with so much new stuff, I almost went bonkers. LOL
Sorry took so long to get back with this.
Robert
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[*] posted on 23-4-2008 at 05:58
Choralozoide


Hi all. New to this forum but I've been using Kristal on/off for about two years? Over a year at least I think.
I use a small daw to record then dump the files into desktop where I mixdown with Kristal. I then often do a final file polish in Nero Wave editor or Audacity.
Recently while trying to fatten up a single electric rhythm guitar track I got to thinking about harmonizers again.
I can't believe I've gone this long without one.
I tried using Audacity to pitch shift a couple duped tracks - too much work - bad results - LOL.
I saw the thread here mentioning Choralozoide.
It sounded perfect for what I was looking for.
Sadly I can't find the download link anywhere. Am I just overlooking it?
Can anyone steer me in the right direction?
Does anyone know of another harmonizer plugin for Kristal? Hopefully not too expensive?
I downloaded something called SpatPitch16 thinking it would work but when the dll was put in the Kristal folder it never showed up in the effects menu. I'm guessing that one doesn't work with Kristal. Never tried to add a VST before.

Cheers.
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[*] posted on 25-4-2008 at 18:55


Hi Toyhouse,

Sadly, this VST has been taken off the web. I think it may have been taking buisiness away from the paid VST's and other hardware. This vst is really hard to use unless you understand music theory due to the fact you need to manually set all the fuctions. The presets are'nt worth a crap. I could send this to you but I'm not sure if it is illegal or not.

Robert
aka Trebor999
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[*] posted on 26-4-2008 at 01:43


Hi Trebor, great to see ya back, mate. I hope those meany accreditation folks are off your back now, weve just finished ours, its amazing to watch our managment pretend to suddenly care for the 4 weeks while these folk were there, but all has mysteriously returned to the usual neglective state, now there gone. :(:mad::(:mad:

Anyways, i digress, I dont think there would be a prob with sending it, it was free and as long as your not selling it, you should be OK. If You havent decompiled the code or altered the program or put it on a public server for download, i cant see a prob, but copyright/intellectual property laws are strange beasts and i may be wrong.

BTW, hard to use is quite an understatement!!!! :P:D




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[*] posted on 26-4-2008 at 03:57


Hey Robert.... You posted a setting list for Choralozoide, and I printed, and promptly lost it. Hows about a re-post?

Bri

>>>>> Edit <<<<<

never mind! It's here:http://www.kristalusers.net/viewthread.php?tid=4129#pid25019




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[*] posted on 26-4-2008 at 04:06
Thanks much guys.


That's ok.
I don't want anyone in trouble - just wishing for some kind of harmonizer for a few jobs around here. It'd be good on digital drums and many other things.
Note; can't buy the real thing - the wife would kill me dead on the spot. Got to be cheap. LOL.
Got the theory part down. It's the recording part that will always, amaze, frustrate and mystify me. LOL.
Been at it this on/off over 25 years and still stink, LOL.
I started with a 2 track sony, tascam and homemade board.
I can't believe what I can do now with such tiny recording gear.
Well - I just completed another song with a single electric guitar in the rhythm track. Many-many other tracks though.

As always I massively over-saturate the tracks. Especially when micing cab. :(
I always wonder if level indicators aren't working fast enough?
Anyway....
I just copied the track a few milliseconds off like always, hard panned left/right and use a little chorus. It always sounds pretty good that way. Not a harmonizer mind you but FAT. I just don't always want the swirling effect. Even set low I can hear it. LOL. Good sometimes - you know?
Thanks again.
Oh yeah....
If someone sees or hears of an alternative please leave a note here if you can? Really appreciate it.
I'll check back every so often.
To be honest - if I were smart, I'd poke around this forum and do some learning.
Cheers.



.
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[*] posted on 26-4-2008 at 04:17


Toyhouse, welcome! Best way to learn and increase your chops would be to enter the next Challenge. It really pushes you to use what you know, and learn what you don't.
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[*] posted on 26-4-2008 at 05:59


"I always wonder if level indicators aren't working fast enough?"

The metering in Kristal is not the greatest for sure. I think most of us keep the peaks hitting around 60% or so.....:cool:




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Despite my plans for today of working on my current projects, I've spent all day playing intellectual patty-cake on various forums.....
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[*] posted on 27-4-2008 at 03:44


Toyhouse.... try this meter: http://www.kaosaudio.com/psp-vintage-meter-free/

It has a faster response to peaks, and I use it in the last master FX slot




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[*] posted on 1-5-2008 at 05:21
Wow thanks....


You folks rock!
Thanks.
I might just enter that challenge!
Hopefully it's judged on more than technical ability.
I still stink in that area. LOL.
Hope some you can stomach a bit harder music.
Not the screaming growling stuff. I'm way too old for that. LOL.
Here's one I did a couple weeks ago.
Keep in mind that I'm the sole guy here.
All parts.
The drums are real - not machine. Well - you'll instantly figure out that I'm no drummer. LOL.
Many technical problems. This was a toughy.
I tried doing a group "chant".
Very tricky. Hard to get words to be heard without drowning out group and visa/versa.
Try it sometime.
I'm sure there's a trick but I don't know what it is.

File here->http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/12/29/1668576/The%2013th%20Baktun%20mix%209%20LO-FI.mp3

I see I'm not the only one who wondered about the meters.
Thanks for the link on meter. I plan to deal with it later tonight.

Cheers and thanks again. I'll check in tomorrow.
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[*] posted on 1-5-2008 at 07:07


Hi toyhouse, A Mans gotta do what a mans gotta do! jump in on a chall or 2, great to have ya.

We have our share of metallurgists here!! but more needed !!!{I work part-time in the metallurgy dept at least, and i regularly do some work in the sanitation/sewerage dept too :P:D:( }


check these out maybe!!!
http://www.soundclick.com/bands/default.cfm?bandID=830386 KAE Collaborations.




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thumbup.gif posted on 1-5-2008 at 19:58


Quote:
Originally posted by Toyhouse
[...]
Been at it this on/off over 25 years and still stink, LOL.
I started with a 2 track sony, tascam and homemade board.
[...]
As always I massively over-saturate the tracks.


OMG me too (except the homemade board, mine was a 6-channel mono thing and I still need to find one of those old Sonys to play some old reels...)

And as far as :
"File here->http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/12/29/1668576/The%2013th%20Baktun%20mix%209%20LO-FI.mp3"

goes, you sure don't stink man... that was a cool tune. well recorded and mixed and you're a great guitarist...

-bg
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[*] posted on 2-5-2008 at 18:00
Thanks all!


As a friend told me the other day, "don't feel bad if you're recordings aren't commercial quality - that's not always the most important part",. Even though I know that to be true, the words are sticking in my head more than ever.
It's all about the song so to speak.

I listened to the files posted and you're guys recordings are clean - something that always eludes me. I am jealous.

All I can say is, "that multiple overdriven guitars, vocals, drums etc. are hard for me to mix so that I can hear everything",. LOL.
That really is the baseline isn't it?
I want to hear a real power chord and all it's magical harmonic content but it gets lost in all the other stuff. Oh well.


Here one more tiny clip of one done yesterday.
Simple guitar riff. Vocals not added yet! Not really rehearsed before recording either. http://www.fileden.com/files/2007/12/29/1668576/1980s%20clip...
Mixed in Xtal using only 8 tracks?
Polished in Nero Wave editor and Audacity.

I broadened the sound stage as it fits the content. This time, the power chords and much of their sizzling content remain intact. Nothing else sounds so huge or exciting.
As many years as I've been doing this - stills gives me goose bumps.

I need to be able to repeat this when I want.
A dumb as it sounds - new strings on the guitar just before recording and just broken in help, hahahaha. Really. Details!

I suppose something with kybds is next!

bgaam - that old Sony is so heavy I almost break my back trying to move it. It's an old tube deck. True two track but left channel couldn't be monitored while recording right. Only the other. It was broken that way for a long time so I had to work around that. Never did fix it. I'm afraid to power it up after so long as damage may occur. I don't have a variac. Hmmm.
It did sound sweet though.

Anyways, and thanks for help and kind words.
Cheers.

Again, thanks for kind words.
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[*] posted on 2-5-2008 at 20:01


Quote:
Originally posted by Toyhouse
1.As a friend told me the other day, "don't feel bad if you're recordings aren't commercial quality - that's not always the most important part",
[...]
2.bgaam - that old Sony is so heavy I almost break my back trying to move it. It's an old tube deck. True two track but left channel couldn't be monitored while recording right.
[...]


1. I just do it to have fun. I dont even try to get red-book compatible since I don't have the equipment for that. I just amuse myself pretty much is all... hehh

2. I check around but even the vintage audio places dont/rarely get em in and they want $$ for em and all I need to do is copy stuff off the reels to disc before they turn to dust...

-bg




http://bgmatthews.com -> over 200 free bg mp3s
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Toyhouse
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[*] posted on 2-5-2008 at 20:54


Are they 1/4 inch? Where are you? I'm in Monterey, Ca.

I'd be more than glad to burn them to disk but as I said, the deck hasn't been powered in over.....20yrs?

Since I work on tube amps now and then I'll just say that it's a dicey thing.
I'd prefer to bring ac up slow with a variac and let it cook for a while to re-condition the electrolytic caps. No doubt they're dried out. I don't have a variac. Wish I did. I'd use on my old guitar amps.

It's always a gamble firing up old tube equipment that hasn't run in years. Always a chance of blowing a cap or two.

You do inspire me to have a look at old machine though.
Might be something I can use here?
I don't even know where to get tape for it. Radio Shack? It's been a long time.

Might be a project for later today. The old lady hates it when I bring some of my old junk into the house though - gets me in trouble.

As for "redbook", you're right, it's for fun - still? I don't think there isn't a one of us that can't get 98% of the way there.
That last 2% we'll never get because the big studios have mics that cost thousands of dollars, racks of the best new and vintage gear etc. My math may be off but I think that last little bit may not be as important as it once was. Could be wrong.


Cheers again.
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[*] posted on 16-10-2009 at 10:14


Very nice piece. This is great work. You really well mixed and aurally, pretty well perfect.




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[*] posted on 16-10-2009 at 13:41


Hello Trebor and ToyHouse, welcome to the forum. I enjoyed the listen to your tunes, thanks for sharing. Look forward to hearing more from you both and a couple new entries in the KAE Challenge.
later,
awg




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[*] posted on 16-10-2009 at 20:38


Ha, I love it when a thread gets revisited from years gone by!



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